Yes, it is the same tree. Easiest solution here would be to delete Wim's photo from '13346', upload it for '15304' and then delete the tree '13346'. I could do this, but then I think the photo would appear with a hyperlink to me instead?
The usual way of dealing with this kind of issues is that the older upload will be respected and that the newer tree will be adjusted to and merged with the older upload. I prefer that option.
Agree with Wim, the older, first registering should be used.
Only two Common Laburnums registered! I wish I had realised this as have seen quite a few good sized Laburnums, probably around 10 metres, but didn't record them as have been meaning to visit Wakefield Castle to measure and confirm the B&I champion height there, 12 metres if I remember correctly? They are lovely trees when in flower. Will have to now try and remember where I have noticed some of the Laburnums.
Hi Rob - you'd need to check identities carefully. 'Common' Laburnum is actually far from common in cultivation now, and rarely exceeds 6 metres or so tall. Larger ones are almost all Alpine Laburnum L. alpinum, or (most frequently of all now) the hybrid between the two, Voss's Laburnum L. × watereri 'Vossii'. Distinguishing them is fairly tricky; I suspect the ones in these photos here are Voss's, but can't confirm it without close-up pics.
Intriguing that you stumbled upon this tree. Don't know how you see it, but in the 60's and 70's the babyboomers in Holland, judged this species as a thoroughly "burgerlijk" plant/tree. A lot of people (probably outside the world of agriculturalists, naturalist and dendrologists) defied this trees.
I used to be one of them. By now, I am a bit independent and judge everything without prejudice. And true, Laburnums can be very nice. That's what a lot of people in Asia think.
Hello Wim, it is a very nice Laburnum, these trees always bring a smile, lift the mood because they are so bright even on a dull day when in flower.
Hello Conifers, probably too late now as the leaves will have gone but any that I measure I will get an ident for from the expert eyes on here.
Rob, you probably know the very big thriving Laburnum in the Valley Gardens in Harrogate (near the north edge of the main park). This is L. alpinum. (There is one much bigger but collapsing one in Ireland, which I've not seen.) Generally L. alpinum grows better the further north you go and I've recorded 14m trees in Scotland. There should be a 15m one somewhere. (12m tree in the park at Wakefield was anagyroides and exceptional in its way, though it's moot whether we should really award champions for height for trees that grow no taller than this.)
Hello Owen, not seen the Laburnum that you mention, I will have to try and find it which will probably be easier with foliage on.
I've just uploaded the Laburnum, as we've discussed it. It has a monumental quality to it - for a Laburnum.
Did you have a look at the trees below the dam at Vrnwy Stephen? On my visit I wasn't alone so just didn't get down to see these but pointed the laser at them from the dam. Probably towards the limit of the laser's range but recorded a consistant c40 metres for the Noble Fir (?) on the right of the photo. Could not see the bases of the Douglas Firs but look as though they may be mid 50 metres possibly to the late. The red trees, Copper Beeches, must be very close to the 34.2 metre record, couldn't see any bases but 34 metres came back from an estimation, looking down on them so will have hit foliage higher then the base.
Yes I saw them but ran out of time to visit them. Incidentally very tall Douglas at North western end of the lake. Some of them could be 53-55m opposite the bird hide.
Abies procera is a tree for Scotland. Likes it cool as its a sub alpine species. There are some massive trees there which must be the largest outside the Pacific Coast. Will reach 60m+.
Drat, I went so far down the west shore of Vyrnwy and then double backed over the dam, stopped at the ex 64 metre Douglas grove and then went over the top and down in to Aber Hirnant and so did miss the 55 metre Douglas you mention. The drive over the top to Aber Hirnant is superb for anyone reading and visiting this area. The day I drove over, I was in amongst a convoy of TVR cars which must have been having a club run out or something, what a drive for them.
Stephen, when you said that you had found trees others hadn't in hidden places and which may be champions, I wondered if Noble may be one and you had found a very tall speciman?
Visit them next time! Yes nice Noble Fir. It is considered only a minor species and has not really been trialled properly in plantations. Big trees are all in collections but best place for big Nobles are at Benmore and Blair Atholl. If they don't cone up at the top (causes breakage but grow new leaders) they could reach 60m+ as they are exposure resistant.
Drive up the other way from Vrnwy up to 'Hell Fire' pass at over 530m a real gem of a ride!
Another beauty Abies concolor 'Lowiana' massive trees in Scotland but only in collections again 60m one day.
Off to Windsor Great Park today to look at a massive Sessile oak one of S. England's finest. Will report back.
Hello Conifers, thanks for placing this one on the map, I have just tweeked him to the correct location.
I wish that I had visited this group of trees, I wouldn't have known how to get down to them but on Google Maps the road down is clear although there is no sign posting at the entrance. I could have driven right down in the car and walked around these in not too much time.
the Greenhow plantation
Interesting what you say as it seems that Noble have been tried in plantations. I spotted a large swathe of blue on Google Maps, went to check and was frankly devastated as much as the trees when I found this. The whole plantation of Abies Procera was in the process of being or had just been felled. The tallest examples of this species in Yorkshire were certainly here, probably some 40 metres, 34 metres is the tallest remaining (County champion) that I measured (above the lady and horse) I was taken at what nice spire shapes they had retained as every single speciman that I have looked at either has a broken top or a squat, flat headed top. This plantation had retained spires probably because they were growing in a dense plantation.
Hello Stephen, I drobe over the 'Hell Fire' pass a few years ago (2011) but drove along the north east shore. I have just had a look on Google Maps and think that I can see your 55 metre Douglas Firs at the north west point of the lake, just over the bridge from the turn to go over the pass mentioned above. They are not visible from where I turned.
I didn't really 'drobe', I drove.
Hi Rob - I improved the map location of this tree from the photos, can you double-check to see if I've got the right tree, please?
I can't find where this nearby tree is though, at the moment it's mapped in the middle of a building (!).
My tall Douglas is along the roadside, just opposite the bird hide on the other side of the lake.
So sad about the Noble Fir. Commercially the timber is not that valuable, could have left them alone. Lets hope that this 'natives only' virus does not spread like Ebola! Not another new planting of scrub please!
Nobles can break at the top due to the weight of cones in autumn gales, but very resistant to exposure to wind generally.
The narrow leaves make me suspect this might be Ulmus × hollandica, rather than pure U. glabra - anyone else have any advice?
die Ulme wurde schon mehrmals wissenschaftlich untersucht. Angeblich soll es die einzige Bergulme Europas sein, die resistent gegen den Ulmensplintkäfer ist. Es wurden schon Klone davon gezogen, die ebenfalls resitent sind. Hier mal ein paar Artikel über die Ulme:
In der Literatur wiederum heißt es, dass die Samen, unbehaarte Flügelnüsschen, für Bergulme sprechen würde.
Ich selbst kann es nicht sagen, was nun stimmt.
Danke! I am happy to accept that ;-)
ich kann es wie gesagt nicht beurteilen. Hoffen wir einfach mal, dass die Fachleute, die sich die Ulme angeschaut haben, richtig liegen ;-)
This photo shows Celtis sp.
Probably Celtis occidentalis (var.cordata) - bark developing flanged ridges, leaves matt, downy and serrated.
Yes saw this tree on my visit last month.
I saw this tree way back in the early nineties, it was flat topped. Yes very luxuriant and healthy. Judging by the fresh fissures in the bark I would say it is still growing rapidly in girth. The trunk also has very little taper and I would not be surprised if it contained 60m3 of wood. It may reach 55-60m eventually but may take another 30 years?
A species which has not reached its full potential in the UK and with climate change, could well excel in the west. It is virtually bombproof with only man/wind/lightning the real hazard. With Giant sequoia Honey fungus and other decay fungi can attack these trees but not Coast Redwood.
Stephen, were the footpaths open on the south west bank of the river through the Dell? I really wanted to have a go at measuring the Corsican Pines which were planted as a shelterbelt and which Owen recorded as 43 metres in 2005 but the whole area was fenced off with 'no admittance' the day that I visited. I could see them but couldn't get any view of any bases? Don't know what was going on that day? I could also see the Nordmann Fir but not the base? 45 metres is the B&I record for Corsican Pine and these had probably or possibly overtaken that? Did you photograph them or attempt a measurement?
The 'no admittance' signs are just for the general public - if you ask at reception, they'll (usually) give you permission to go over them once they know why you're there if it's a special reason like measuring trees. At least that's how it used to be. All they'd likely ask of you is to give them a copy of the measurements afterward.
Hello Conifers, you may be right. The paths up the hillside were blocked off with pink ribbon which I thought unusual and that something may have happened further up, perhaps unsafe paths or a landslide?
I've just added some historic measurements for this tree. It's growing remarkably steadily! (Tim, one feature that could be added is a calculation of annual growth-rate between the planting date and the first measurement for trees with known planting dates?)
Rob, the Corsican Pine was very difficult to measure tangent-fashion, as they generally are, and it could have been more than 43m. But probably also hard to see the highest shoots with laser. As it's part of the official 'shelterbelt' it may not have added more height. Much of the garden was also shut to the public on my visit in 2005 - is this a permanent condition? I know that recently Bodnant has been undergoing 'restoration' at the urging of various influentual landscape gardeners. This is a word that always fills me with dread as it generally means cutting down the existing 100-year-old trees and planting new ones to 'recreate the spirit in which the garden was originally conceived' or words to that effect. At least they've spared this one.
Hello Owen, perhaps we need a petition from someone, the Tree Register members perhaps amongts others to protect these older trees, it would be tragic if any of the tall conifers and others were felled just for the sake of it, they are irreplaceable.
This Coastie doesn't grow very fast does it, I measured 51 metres for it MT standard reading (centre of base on slope), Tree Register standard it will be about 50.4 metres I estimate, the girth probably now 6 metres perhaps taking into account Stephen's comments. It looks glaucousy as you described so will it be some sort of variant and hence have a lower growth rate?
Rob and All
Areas are being developed and should be open next spring, apparently they take parties of people round on certain days. I did not see any felling, but I was saddened to see the big Western Hemlock had been felled.
The Corsican I did not see, but it appears the dreaded Dothistroma which Corsican is very susceptible has just started to infect trees.
Coast Redwood is superb. Still growing rapidly judging by the new fresh fissures in the bark at the base. Difficult tree to measure due to the stream! Possibly within the top 5 for size in the Northern Hemisphere outside California?
The Corsican at Puck Pitts in the New Forest. Have found a tree which could be taller than 45m, I know you have measured some of them but this tree is tucked away from the footpath.
Second largest Douglas Fir in Canada discovered
Thought you might have seen this, but if not look below.
This appalling Forestry practice continues! This would not happen in the UK!
The tree is sadly doomed and will blow over in the next Pacific gale.
Trees such as these need the whole valley side to protect them.
See 23/9/14 post to view it
Sorry meant 23/3/14 post not easy to find.
How old 4-500 years?
This is not forestry and I thought the Amazon was bad!
Is there any hope for the Human Race!!
You can sign an online petition here:
A technical hint: it is possible to post Youtube videos on the discussion page.
To do that, on the Youtube page of the video, click on "Share" somewhere below the video and then on "Embed".
Just copy paste the text you see there in your comment.
The second photo down in Conifer's link (the man looking up the trunk), there is a horizontal line across the base of the trunk, is this a cut mark, have they had a bite at this tree?
Pinus strobus is universally called "white pine" throughout its natural range. I have never in my life heard it called Weymouth pine.
More accurately, Eastern White Pine, so as to distinguish it from e.g. Pinus monticola (Western White Pine).
This is an interesting point, as we have English (country) names for trees on this site in the English language version rather than American ones, which would be more logical for trees with an American distribution. In this case 'Weymouth' commemorates Captain George Weymouth who first brought the tree to England in the early 17th century but has no relevance to American users of this site. I shan't offer to change the names to the American ones myself as I don't know all of them!
I'd favour using native names (i.e., use Eastern White Pine for Pinus strobus), provided they are botanically accurate (thus use e.g. Lawson's Cypress for Chamaecyparis lawsoniana, and not call it a cedar Cedrus as many in the USA regrettably misidentify it).
That sounds reasonable.
I agree and have changed the English name of Pinus strobus
to eastern white pine.
These are Quercus robur acorns ;-)
Ofcourse. Too late in the evening I guess, :-))